Gorgritch_Umie_Killa

Claiming a scientific authority that doesn’t exist and someone calling you on it, isn’t putting words in your mouth. Its a reaction to an unjustified claim to authority, that undermines that authority when it is actually appropriate.

It also undermines your own argument. Its good to see you’re reply shifted position.

How has ‘what is moral’ come to be scientifically settled?

Different cultures across the world have different morals. Yet for this statement to be true, there must be an agreed scientific consensus on a quantitative metric and its impact on a fundamentally unscientific det of cultural rules.

The appeal to scientific authority in this statement undermines a good moral argument to be made about inequity and excessive individual rights to property.

This is just a call to some pop-science, at best, meant to engage the rage. It has no better scientific basis than trickle down economics does.

Nationalsim v Patriotism.

I’s avoiding patriotism, (although also acceptable), because its often a mistake to divide each other apart if its unnecessary. In this case, the vast majority of the US population are not in some MAGA movement/cult. In fact about a third of US voters we can only say have lent these people their votes. However, many more than that would likely accept a nationalistic self image as a fair description of themselves.

I specifically want to counter the idea that to be nationalistic is only a negative thing. Civic Nationalism is a very important thing for countries like ours. The broad designation ‘nationalist’ shouldn’t be surrendered, especially where common perceptions lead to unfavourable results, (see what i say above about likely self images).

Recognition of common interests is also harder if people are speaking different dialects. In this case there is no need to be distanced by that linguistic difference.

By avoiding its use, the broader population can misunderstand civic minded/progressive/left/etc, peoples lack of referrals to ‘nationalism’ as being ashamed of, or hating, their country.

This (dictionary.com) is a good base for the terms. You’re right to assume the negative connotations. Hopefully you see i’s attempting to counter the popular use by pointing out its importance.

In the context of my comment about the US flag, i saw someone paint one of those blue line US flags with the LGBTQ+ rainbow colours. In my opinion civic minded US people should be taking back their flag in those ways more often.

First and foremost, i’m an Australian. I know USA politics pretty well, but its not my context, i don’t usually comment on this stuff on ‘wild lemmy’ to this depth, because i’m painfully aware that context matters. The only reason i’m commenting is because i know the fear and depression setting in won’t help, you all gota carry on, and depression/anger won’t help the effectiveness of your efforts. Take that as a caveat to dismiss me if you feel it just misses the mark.

Note: when i say ‘your’ i’m meaning it as a plural.

Okay, so in my minds eye, my comment was really for any scientist/stakeholder with an ongoing specific interest in an ongoing green project or something of that nature. Its not a comment for winning arguments with friends, its a comment for getting as close to what you need, from the people in power. Its Dale Carnegie, or Real Politik. So the “leverage”, the “extraction” is all refering to a specific stakeholders case.

I’ll start at the end, because i felt that was one of the more important parts. “Making demands they don’t want to refuse” doesn’t mean demanding exactly what you want and how you want it,

Take a street protest, as an example, the MAGAs will love nothing more than to stomp down a big street protest for climate action. It may be cathartic for the people at the protest to be a part of that protest, but whatever/if concessions are given will be ‘blood out of a stone’. In this case they will do almost anything in their refusal.

I’m not saying don’t protest, i’m sure there will be, and i hope they shake the foundations of Washington or wherever they are held. Please look after yourselves, i think the authorities will be coming for a fight.

Or the other option, i could use the first example of Solar Panels. Use China, the elite are so terrified they’re losing to China they’re willing to do almost anything. So state the case that China makes the most/best Solar panels. Don’t define it in terms of climate action, state it in ‘power and domination’ terms. Appeal to their natural authoritive tendencies (they trust their own authority, undermine that trust). You could also make it binary China’s win, is the US’ loss and hopefully by the end they “won’t want to refuse”.

These two examples, i hope, show you both sides of that statement. They won’t be perfect, and like any negotiation there never a guarantee it’ll work. But its a strategy that stakeholders like scientists might need to rely on for the greater good.

MAGA is a cult

After reading your paragraph below this I don’t think you can justify calling it a cult in the traditional sense. I agree, its murky at best.

Its maybe a cult of personality, its probably better described as a cult of ragetainment. Once people get bored, they tend to drift away, let them get bored, that means people who disagree shouldn’t rise to the bait. Instead make a joke out of it, satire is a sensationally satisfying art. Boredom is good it gives the brain time to be thoughtful, instead of reacting to the latest ragebait.

I’m definitely uncomfortable classing MAGA as a cult in the traditional sense. Maybe its a movement. My key point here is the strong and continued correlation between Trump voters and Bernie, and AOC voters. This is key in my understanding. It means theres a broad rejection of the status quo.

I’d like to caveat the above by acknowledging this isn’t a one to one correlation. But, i could make a similar argument for the conservative-religious and trump voters, its more of a marriage of convenience in that instance.

There is absolutely a section who are fully signed up Trump. But in terms of voter rolls its likely a smaller share of voters than we give it credit.

Lastly, appeals to nationalism aren’t MAGAs or fascists, or Conservatives, or what-evers exclusive domain. If your proud of where your from, even if its in the most roundabout ways, then you have some nationalism. Don’t let a words bad reputation hold you back from making the place you love somewhere you can be even more proud of, Liberals, leftists, whatevers can be nationalistic to. Use that USA flag of yours in your own ways, theres no need to cede that shit to authoritarians.

Cheers!

Bookmarked as well, if my bookmarks are anything to go by, thats as rare as you suggest :)

Pivot. Vary the product perception.

Speak to nationalism, “you don’t want those other people over there to build all the shiny roof tile things, do you?”

Stroke the ego’s, “Is this Houston’s House or Mar’a’Lago’s House? Those cowboys don’t know the Nation, they’re kickin around paddocks cosplaying Butch Cassidy and the Sundance kid.”

Make em laugh, then buy a round, and always remember they’re not you’re friend, make them work in the relationship. Extract enough to make it worth your time.

Not engaging isn’t an answer; begging never got medieval peasants anywhere, why should it help you.

Don’t say sorry, no pont being depressed or feeling shame, remain focused on the objectives you’ve set. If erstwhile allies/friends call you out, hopefully they’ll understand later. Don’t boast if you have a win the game hasn’t stopped.

Use your leverage and <ins>make the demands they don’t want to refuse</ins>.

She is telling you how she goes about making decisions i.e. deferring to authority.

This is really insightful. Thanks.

Tickets/Voucher for a rock climbing centre could be up his alley.

If you want something that will last you could get him a powder bag, or his first Carabiner as well.

Be prepared that the climbing place might not let him use the Carabiner in conjunction with their equipment though, so it might sit around until he got his own harness if he ever went that far. Powder bag would be all good.

Welcome!!! Come over to Aussie Zone for a banter anytime you like!

So, further to mu previous comment, no you shouldn’t need to create an account on each instance you want to explore. At best creating an account on the instance might make navigability better.

Mastodon is single developer

I think he has a few people with him now. But i listened to the interview at the start of the year, so i’m starting to the detail.

Exploring instances should be as easy as looking up any other website. At least to get their ‘local’ front page. Or just navigate to them through that link above.

As an example you could look up jlai.lu, a french instance. They’re pretty active.

No idea on Mastodon myself. I’ve heard a couple interviews of the developer, seems like a cool guy. But thats about all i can say.

I’s playing round with this instance and community finder the other night, works really well. Might be useful to find a more active community that you’ll enjoy.

https://lemmyverse.net/communities

The instance could be a problem if you scroll through the ‘local’ feed often and thats where you see a lot of things you don’t wish to see. A European or special interest instance might suit your context, (Portuguese?), better.

I spend more time on my ‘local’ (aussie zone) feed than ‘subscribed’ or ‘all’ and its definitely nicer, so a move like this can work.

But you could also optimise your own ‘subscriber’ feed as another option.

A roadway allowed multiple speeds across the lanes could be how to get around this.

If the citizens of a transport zone don’t like the rules as they stand, ie, one single speed for all lanes, they should lobby to vary them.

Apart from cases where multiple speeds happen, the speed limit is the speed limit, the person behind contravenes rules if they speed, use the shoulder, etc. They’re in the wrong, they have agency, and decide to cause the unsafe situation.

The person ahead, as that video showed to the tune of straight funktown, may cause worsened traffic conditions, but they’re not the people being dangerous on the road. (Assuming they are going within the range of the expected limit)

1. Often people use those lanes to speed. If a car ahead is overtaking at or within a reasonable range of the speed limit, but not at the speed the speeder wants to travel. The speeder must be patient, they don’t get to dictate what manoeuvres are happening ahead.

2. The argument you present at the end isn’t logical,

… Always do the safest thing.

I can largely agree with this sentiment, but you say before,

People who sit in lane 3 at 69mph are breaking the law and likely to cause an accident by forcing people to pass on the wrong side out of frustration (yes illegal but they will do it)…

If undercutting is the most unsafe thing for the person behind to do in the situation, then as your sentiment captures, the frustrated party undercutting are still in the wrong.

They are in the wrong because, they have failed to ‘always do the safest thing’ in the given situation.

3. Never be the reason someone else does something stupid on the road.

Nice sentiment again, but it implicitly assigns a rigid cause and effect regime to a situation where the ‘frustrated party’ behind has their own agency and likely as much training. There is no necessity that they undercut, it is a choice the party behind makes. The cause does not necessitate that effect, at best it could contribute.

In essence the sentiment shifts the blame from the person causing a potential accident (the undercutter), to the person ahead who, at worst, is causing poor traffic conditions.

Speed limit is the speed limit. End of.

If someone wants to go above the speed limit in the fast lane, then they’re contravening road rules.

No matter what social norm people believe there to be, it doesn’t have precedence over the speed limits.

In a case where the the car in front is going slower than the speed limit, it would be good etiquette though to move over.

Hi!

Moderator from !perth@aussie.zone here.

Just been playing around using the spoiler tags as makeshift drop down lists in the sidebar for the Perth/WesternAustralia community, and noticed the ‘spoiler’ markdown formatting isn’t recognised in the ‘about’ page on the Sync app. :)

The LA metro? Like, theres a passenger/commuter train in LA?

We like to believe our societies are a calm, rational place of logical decision makers.

We’re actually a rowdy bunch of anachronistic apes, with a chronic case of the hypocrititis.

Khan Academy